Losing Weight Faster Than I Thought Possible

Old 06-14-2010, 12:22 PM
  #31  
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I was 126kgs, at 18 and within the first week of cutting out crap food and doing small exercises I lost 7ish kgs in the first week. So I wouldnt freak out about it if I was you. Just keep up the good week mate, its so worth it. Mad props to you.
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Old 07-20-2010, 03:55 PM
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I would be careful about very rapid weight loss. If it is all fat you are losing it can be bad. The reason the recommended weight loss is 2 lbs. per week. is because the chemical breakdown of fat causes ketones to be released in your body. Now, with a small amount of ketones your body can excrete them without harm. But, if you breakdown a lot of fat, and thereby release many ketones, they can build up in your bloodstream and cause ketoacidosis, which is basically your blood Ph has become too acidic. Ketoacidosis is not a good thing, which is why we all need to be careful. However, some people can lose lots of fat and have no problem, everyones different. And if you do have ketoacidosis you will know, your gona feel like crap. So don't worry that you have it
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Old 07-20-2010, 08:08 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by joshuam168 View Post
I would be careful about very rapid weight loss. If it is all fat you are losing it can be bad. The reason the recommended weight loss is 2 lbs. per week. is because the chemical breakdown of fat causes ketones to be released in your body. Now, with a small amount of ketones your body can excrete them without harm. But, if you breakdown a lot of fat, and thereby release many ketones, they can build up in your bloodstream and cause ketoacidosis, which is basically your blood Ph has become too acidic.
Josh, I think you're confusing ketoacidosis with ketosis. When you break down fat for bodily metabolism, the body does turn it into ketone bodies. However, these ketone bodies are then rapidly burned off as fuel much like glucose. The products of this metabolism are mainly water and acetyl-CoA, an intermediate in the same pathway used to burn glucose. If you can train your body to burn ketones preferentially (by limiting carbs), you can burn off a lot of fat this way — particularly if you've got a lot to lose.

However, excess ketone bodies can have an impact on blood pH. Luckily, this can be easily offset by the reckless consumption of mineral-rich leafy greens. So, eat your vegetables!
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Old 07-21-2010, 05:12 AM
  #34  
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Yes, you are correct, I did mean ketosis. However, your body does not use ketones as a form of energy. They are a byproduct that results from an incomplete breakdown of fat. Rapid weight loss can cause ketones to build up in the blood stream and the urine....not good for your health.
To try and combat this make sure you incorporate a balanced amount of carbohydrates in your diet. Carbohydrates can help the fat to breakdown correctly and completely.
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Old 07-21-2010, 07:55 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by joshuam168 View Post
However, your body does not use ketones as a form of energy. They are a byproduct that results from an incomplete breakdown of fat.
I'm afraid your statement is factually incorrect. Ketones are most commonly used as energy in the brain alongside glucose, although they can be used as energy in any other organ tissue as well. They are how fat is used as energy ó "burned" ó during long-duration cardio past the point of glycogen depletion. The other products of fat breakdown via a separate pathway, glycerol and free fatty acids, have other functions in the body, but not as energy.

Diabetic or alcoholic ketoacidosis is what happens when ketones build up in your bloodstream because of an inability to clear them due to a pathological or self-induced condition. In the case of uncontrolled diabetes, chronically high insulin levels hinder the use of ketones as fuel in favor of glucose that simply isn't available. The body then breaks down even more fat to be used as fuel, which the body still cannot assimilate into the tissue, because of the free insulin. That's when free ketones reach a high enough concentration to cause dangerous acute acidosis. With alcoholism a similar scenario develops, except that the mechanism organ tissues use to convert ketones into acetyl-CoA is hindered due to all the free ethanol floating around.

Ketosis is a natural process developed to sustain us through periods of scarcity. If you had a lot of fat to lose and you kicked your body into ketosis, this isn't dangerous in any way as long as you continue to stay active, so that the ketones can continue to be used as fuel.
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Old 07-21-2010, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by tandoorichicken View Post
I'm afraid your statement is factually incorrect. Ketones are most commonly used as energy in the brain alongside glucose, although they can be used as energy in any other organ tissue as well. They are how fat is used as energy ó "burned" ó during long-duration cardio past the point of glycogen depletion. The other products of fat breakdown via a separate pathway, glycerol and free fatty acids, have other functions in the body, but not as energy.
I'm sorry but you are incorrect. I do not want people reading this forum to be mislead by your statements and have health problems. Ketones are NOT energy they are excreted by our kidneys as waste. Fat gets turned into glucose for energy, energy is not released via ketones. I do not get my info from wikipedia. My source is the book Foundations of Nursing 2nd edition by Lois White publish date of 2007.
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Old 07-21-2010, 03:14 PM
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Well, you are both right to a point.

Ketones are a by product of buring fat. This is most commonly seen when insulin levels are very low, not allowing the body to use glucose for energy. So, instead the body burns fat and ketones are created as a by product. When the body cannot utilize glucose for energy (like when insulin is too low), the brain (and to a lesser degree other organs) use ketones as energy.
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Old 07-21-2010, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by stocky1 View Post
Well, you are both right to a point.

Ketones are a by product of buring fat. This is most commonly seen when insulin levels are very low, not allowing the body to use glucose for energy. So, instead the body burns fat and ketones are created as a by product. When the body cannot utilize glucose for energy (like when insulin is too low), the brain (and to a lesser degree other organs) use ketones as energy.
Ok here is a direct quote from the book i stated earlier, word for word.

"A mild deficiency of carbohydrates can result in weight loss and fatigue. A diet seriously deficient in carbohydrates causes extra fat to be metabolized to meet the body's energy needs. Without carbohydrates, fat is incompletely oxidized, producing ketones, an acid by-product, which accumulates in the blood and urine causing ketosis."

Ketones cannot be used as energy. In the case of diabetes, the body thinks it does have enough glucose and so breaks down more fat, to provide more glucose, which releases ketones, those ketones then build up, if used as energy they would not build up, and cause ketoacidosis.
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Old 07-21-2010, 06:38 PM
  #39  
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Watch who you accuse of wiki-ing. Fat is utilized as energy in three different ways.

Direct quotes from Human Physiology, 10th Ed. by Widmaier, Raff, & Strang, Pub. 2006, "Ch. 16 - Regulation of Organic Metabolism and Energy Balance:"

Gluconeogenesis
"The 180 g of glucose per day produced by gluconeogenesis in the liver (and kidneys) during fasting supplies 720kcal of energy. Normal total energy expenditure for and average adult is 1500 - 3000 kcal/day. Therefore gluconeogenesis cannot supply all the body's energy needs."

Which leads us to...

Fatty Acid Metabolism
"Now we focus on the liberated fatty acids, which circulate bound to plasma albumin. (Despite this binding to protein, they are known as free fatty acids because they are "free" of glycerol). The circulating fatty acids are taken up and metabolized by almost all tissues, excluding the nervous system. They provide energy in two ways: (1) they first undergo beta-oxidation to yield hydrogen atoms, which go on to oxidative phosphorylation, and (2) acetyl-CoA, which enters the Krebs cycle and is catabolized to CO2 and water."

"The liver is unique, however, in that most of the acetyl-CoA it forms from fatty acids does not enter the Krebs cycle but is processed into three compounds collectively called ketones. Ketones are released into the blood and provide an important energy source for the many tissues, including the brain, capable of oxidizing them via the Krebs cycle."

"The net result of fatty acid and ketone utilization during fasting is the provision of energy for the body and sparing of glucose for the brain. Moreover, as just emphasized, the brain can use ketones for an energy source, and it does so increasingly as ketones build up in the blood during the first few days of a fast. The survival value of this phenomenon is significant: when the brain reduces its glucose requirement by utilizing ketones, much less protein breakdown is required to supply amino acids for gluconeogenesis. Accordingly, the protein stores will last longer, and the ability to withstand a long fast without serious tissue damage is enhanced."

A substantial caloric deficit during fat loss can be interpreted by a body as a fast or partial fast, throwing it into ketogenesis. This process is a survival mechanism, and as I said before, unless you have some serious, uncontrolled pathological condition that would prevent the above from happening, you aren't in any serious danger from your subsequent rapid weight loss.

Sorry for the long physiology lesson, but this should help everyone all around get a better picture of how ketogenesis really works in the body.
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Old 07-21-2010, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by joshuam168 View Post
Ok here is a direct quote from the book i stated earlier, word for word.

"A mild deficiency of carbohydrates can result in weight loss and fatigue. A diet seriously deficient in carbohydrates causes extra fat to be metabolized to meet the body's energy needs. Without carbohydrates, fat is incompletely oxidized, producing ketones, an acid by-product, which accumulates in the blood and urine causing ketosis."

Ketones cannot be used as energy. In the case of diabetes, the body thinks it does have enough glucose and so breaks down more fat, to provide more glucose, which releases ketones, those ketones then build up, if used as energy they would not build up, and cause ketoacidosis.
Where in there does it say ketones cannot be used as energy? Just because ketones are a by product of fat oxidation does not mean they cannot be used as energy.

Yes, your basic idea that if ketones are used up then they wouldn't build up is correct. However, you cannot make simple statements an ignore the complete view on the topic.

In the case of ketones in diabetes building up (thus by your logic cannot be, being used for energy): No they will build up because the total amount of ketones created by fat oxidation far out the amount used for energy.

You really love to grasp at things that are not addressed in what you read.
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